Where are the Geographic Coordinates?

The draft EA and supplementary materials are missing way-points making it impossible to map the changes.

One of the first tasks I had was to find out where these new flight paths were. I wanted to put them on a map and discover which houses and neighborhoods these new concentrated flight paths would overfly. Through a prior meeting we knew ahead of time that EA wouldn’t have a map that showed street level detail, but I was confident I could make my own. All one needed was the flight path, way-points, altitudes and coordinates.

The Design Tech Team report had all the new flight paths. Here is what one of the plates looked like:

SoCal_Metroplex_Design_Team_Tech_Report-183

  • Flight paths – CHECK
  • Way-points – CHECK
  • Altitudes! – CHECK
  • Coordinates – ???

No geographic coordinates- the flight path is just floating in white space. There is a schematic outline of the coast but the image is such low res that I couldn’t make an accurate map from it. None of the STAR’s,  SID’s, RNAV’s, or RNP’s had any geo-referencing.

This prompts my first comment to the FAA:

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Subject: Request Geographic Information for New Waypoints
From: Stephen Murray
To: 9-ANM-SoCalOAPM@faa.gov

Mr Robert Henry & Mr Ryan Weller,

This comment is a request for the geographic information for new waypoints that is not included within the Draft Environmental Assessment.

The diagrams of the proposed flight paths in the “SoCal Metroplex Design Team Tech Report” and “Airport Proposed Procedures” include new waypoints. These waypoints have important altitude information but are lacking the latitude and longitude that would place them in specific geographic locations. Geographic coordinates are an integral piece of the design of the waypoints and are needed to accurately map the procedures for comparison purposes. Without knowing the exact and relative placement of the proposed procedures we are unable to fully evaluate or understand their effects.

Below is a list of 83 new waypoints I collected from the LAX West Flow STARs that lack identifying geographic information. The LAX West Flow SIDS have new waypoints as well as the East Flow STAR and SIDs – I suspect that these respective new waypoints will also be missing relevant geographic information. Unlike existing waypoints that are already in use, new waypoints aren’t published in a publicly accessible table and their geographic coordinates can only be received through a request like this to the design team.

Could you release the latitude and longitude coordinates for these 83 new waypoints to the standard accuracy of 1/100 of a second? Could you also release all the new waypoints for LAX that I haven’t listed? In addition, to be fair, I think you should also release coordinates to ALL new waypoints without geographic references created in the study area.

I believe the public would like to thoroughly review all the proposed flight procedures, evaluate potential noise, pollution and other environmental impacts and submit comments accordingly. Additionally I believe our elected representatives would like to be able to help residents with their concerns, clarify and direct them appropriately. By the FAA supplying additional clarifying information, such as waypoint coordinates, I hope that the communities can better engage and understand the draft Environmental Assessment. This will allow the FAA to receive additional valuable information that will allow refinements to procedure design prior to implementation. This in turn will help the FAA achieve a higher level of success with the projects implementation.

Thank you for your consideration to this request.

Stephen Murray

Waypoint New Procedure
WADUP HLYWD1 STAR
DAAAY HLYWD1 STAR
BRUEN HLYWD1 STAR
HLYWD HLYWD1 STAR
MNROE HLYWD1 STAR
MDLER HLYWD1 STAR
NWMAN HLYWD1 STAR
MCQWN HLYWD1 STAR
ESTWD HLYWD1 STAR
GABBL HLYWD1 STAR
FNNDA HLYWD1 STAR
AVATR HLYWD1 STAR
NEILE HLYWD1 STAR
SEAVU HLYWD1 STAR
CRCUS ANJLL1 STAR
BOYEL ANJLL1 STAR
CAANN ANJLL1 STAR
LEMMN ANJLL1 STAR
BCALL ANJLL1 STAR
OTOOL ANJLL1 STAR
ANJLL ANJLL1 STAR
GLESN ANJLL1 STAR
SALYY ANJLL1 STAR
SHTNR ANJLL1 STAR
HAKMN ANJLL1 STAR
SLLRS ANJLL1 STAR
DNERO ANJLL1 STAR
CGNEY ANJLL1 STAR
LAAMP SNSST1 STAR
LAHVA SNSST1 STAR
SOLAY SNSST1 STAR
SNSTT SNSST1 STAR
RNCHO SNSST1 STAR
ASUTA SNSST1 STAR
MADOW OLAAA1 STAR
PESOZ OLAAA1 STAR
OLAAA OLAAA1 STAR
REGGO OLAAA1 STAR
TRNDO OLAAA1 STAR
SHHOW GOATZ1 STAR
PHUNN GOATZ1 STAR
DIRBY GOATZ1 STAR
FICKY GOATZ1 STAR
WSHOT CRSHR1 STAR
PIBBB CRSHR1 STAR
COOOP CRSHR1 STAR
LOUSE CRSHR1 STAR
GKNEE CRSHR1 STAR
WUANN CRSHR1 STAR
GNZZO CRSHR1 STAR
CRSHR CRSHR1 STAR
KEVVI CRSHR1 STAR
KORMC CRSHR1 STAR
CLIFY CRSHR1 STAR
DAHJR CRSHR1 STAR
GADDO CRSHR1 STAR
STADD IRNMN1 STAR
BURGL IRNMN1 STAR
DOUIT IRNMN1 STAR
CROWY IRNMN1 STAR
MUPTT IRNMN1 STAR
MDOTS IRNMN1 STAR
GRIPR IRNMN1 STAR
BIKNG IRNMN1 STAR
RUNNN IRNMN1 STAR
IRNMN IRNMN1 STAR
FRASR IRNMN1 STAR
REYES IRNMN1 STAR
TOKIO HUULL1 STAR
MANZZ HUULL1 STAR
RBOTO HUULL1 STAR
LLEVI HUULL1 STAR
HUULL HUULL1 STAR
PURSE BOGET1/WAYV1 STAR
WELUM BOGET1/WAYV1 STAR
NIPIY BOGET1/WAYV1 STAR
TAAAP BOGET1/WAYV1 STAR
JOHHN BOGET1/WAYV1 STAR
BASAL BOGET1/WAYV1 STAR
WNCHL BOGET1/WAYV1 STAR
COWWS BOGET1/WAYV1 STAR
CHKNZ BOGET1/WAYV1 STAR
ROPEZ BOGET1/WAYV1 STAR